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 Man sinned and... 
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Unread post Man sinned and...
So adam and eve were in garden of eden.

adam ate from the forbidden tree.

Mankind was banished to Earth as punishment.

So earth is like a place of exile.

But only MAN sinned, so why are there animals and Jins here.

Why are the above also on earth, they did not sin?

Were the animals and jin already on earth before mankind was banished here?

so was the earth created as a place of exile after the original sin, or did earth along with it's animals and jin already exist before then?


Wed Nov 23, 2011 6:59 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
Jinn sinned before mankind was even created. That's why Shaytan (The Devil Aka Jinn) was abolished from the heavens.

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Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:38 am
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
No shaytaan was banished for not bowing before man. It was a punishment.


Thu Nov 24, 2011 6:45 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
rafhelp wrote:
No shaytaan was banished for not bowing before man. It was a punishment.


Its all Azazil aka Iblees fault for not bowing down before Adam. You can read the whole story if u search these forums.

Animals exist here so we can be fed! There was no fast food 1500 years ago :S.


Sat Nov 26, 2011 4:23 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
the question is about timing. According to quran jinn, angels, shaytaan were created before man, as it says stuff like shaytaan and angels were asked to bow down to man. It also says shaytaan was of the jinn therefore this means they existed before man.

But the questiion was was the earth created before man or was it created as a place of exile for man, for sinning, then also were the other creature of allah placed on the earth at the same time as man or before.

yes animal were placed here for food, but we cant eat alot of these, so i guess there function is to maintain equiilibrium, i.e the food chain. But then why he place the unseen here aswell. This is not curiosity, but id like to get my facts straight. I have not read anywhere which states earth was created by god before or after he created man.

anyway its not a big deal, just thought someone might know


Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:07 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
Short answer, the earth was created before humans. And the Jinn were the viceregents over the earth, but they committed too many sins - and therefore, Allah created Adam AS and Hawa AS so they nd their progeny can be the new viceregents over the earth.

I am doing some research for you and will post a full, indepth explanation of events for you soon insha-Allah

Scimi


Thu Dec 01, 2011 6:50 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
Ok, here is the text, written out from Ibn Kathirs book "The Stories of the Prophets (pbut) from Adam AS to Muhammad PBUH" (Qissas al Anbiyya) Ad Damishiqi circa 700 - 774 AH

In The Quran, Surah al-Baqarah in it's fourth section:

And when your Lord said to the angels, "I am going to place a viceregent on the earth," they said "What, will YOU place therein one who will do corruption and theft; and shed blood, while we glorify YOUR praise and sanctify YOU?" HE said, "Surely, I know that which you do not." And HE taught Adam the names of all (things), then HE presented them to the angels, saying "Inform ME the names of those, if you are truthful." They said, "YOU are glorified, we have no knowledge except that which YOU have taught us. Surely, YOU are the Knower, the Wise." HE said, "O Adam, inform them of the names of those (things)," and when Adam had informed them of their names, HE (Allah) said "Did I not tell you, that I know the secret of the heavens and the earth, and I know what you reveal and what you conceal?"

And (recall) when WE said to the angels, "Prostrate yourselves before Adam" they (all) prostrated themselves, except Iblis. He refused, and showed arrogance and so became on of the disbelievers.

And WE said, "O Adam, dwell you and your wife, in the garden, and eat thereof freely whatever you desire, but come not near this tree, lest you become an evil doers." But Satan made them to slip therefrom and bought them out of that state (of felicity) they were in, and WE said "Get out (all) down, each of you an enemy to the other; and there shall be on earth a dwelling and provision for a time." The Adam received certain words (of revelation) from his Lord, and HE relented towards him. Surely, HE is the Relenting, the Merciful. WE said, "Get you down all from here yet there shall come to you guidance from ME; Then whosoever follows MY guidance, no fear shall be on them, nor shall they grieve."

And those who disbelieve and belie OUR revelation, they are companions of the fire, therein they shall abide.

(Al-baqarah, 2:30-39)

Almighty Allah also revealed:

And surely, We created you (your father Adam) and then gave you shape (thenoble shape of a human being), then We told the angels, "Prostrate to Adam",and they prostrated, except Iblis, he refused to be those who prostrate. Allah said: "What prevented you (O Iblis) that you did not postrate when I commanded you?" Iblis said: "yI am better than him (Adam), You created me from fire and him Youcreated from clay." Allah said: "O Iblis get down from this (Paradise), it is not for you to be arrogant here. Get out for you are of those humiliated and disgraced." Iblis said: "Allow me respite till the Day they are raised up (Day of Resurrection).[/color]" Allah said: "You are of those allowed respite." Iblis said: "Because You have sent me astray, surely I will sit in wait against them (human beings) on Your Straight Path. Then I will come to them frombefore them and behind them, from their right and from their left and You will not find most of them as thankful ones (they will not be dutiful to You)." Allah said: "Get out from Paradise, disgraced and expelled. Whoever of them(mankind) will follow you, then surely I will fill Hell with you all." "And O Adam! Dwell you and your wife in Paradise, and eat thereof as you bothwish, but approach not this tree otherwise you both will be of the Zalimeen(unjust and wrongdoers)."

Then Satan whispered suggestions to them both in order to uncover that which was hidden from them of their private parts before, he said: "Your Lord did not forbid you this tree save you should become angels or become of the immortals." Satan swore by Allah to them both saying: "Verily I am one of the sincere well wishers for you both." So he misled them with deception. Then when they tasted of the tree, that whichwas hidden from them of their shame (private parts) became manifest to themand they began to stick together the leaves of Paradise over themselves (in order to cover their shame). Their Lord called out to them saying "Did I not forbid youthat tree and tell you, Verily Satan is an open enemy unto you?" They said: "Our Lord! We have wronged ourselves. If You forgive us not, and bestow not upon us Your Mercy, we shall certainly be of the losers." Allah said:"Get down one of you an enemy to the other (i.e. Adam, Eve, and Satan etc). Onearth will be a dwelling place for you and an enjoyment, for a time." He said: "therein you shall live, and therein you shall die, and from it you shall bebrought out (resurrected)."
(Chapter 7:11-25 Qur'an)

We imagine when Allah the Almighty decided to create Adam: He addressed His angels and told them to prostrate before him. He did not mean to ask their opinion or take their advice, for He is above that. Allah the Exalted told them that He was going to create a vicegerent on the earth who would have children and grandchildren who would corrupt the earth and shed each other's blood. That is why the angels said to Allah the Almighty: "Will You place therein those who will make mischief therein and shed blood!" (Chapter 2:30 Quran).There are old traditions about the angels before the creation of Adam. According to Ibn Qatadah,it was said that the angels were informed about the creation of Adam and his progency by the jinn who lived before Adam. Abdullah Ibn Umar said that the jinn had existed for about 2000 years before Adam and then shed blood. Therefore Allah sent on them an army of angels that drovethem out to the depths of the seas.

Ibn Abi Hatim narrated from Ali jafar Al Baqer that the angels were informed that man would cause wickedness and shed blood on earth. It was also said that they knew that no one would becreated on earth who would not be wicked and shed blood. Whether or not these traditions are correct, the angels did understand that Allah would create a vicegerent on earth. Allah the Almighty announced that HE was going to create a human beingout of clay, that HE would mold him and blow His spirit into him and then the angels should prostrate before him.

Abi Musa al Sha'arai narrated that the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Allah created Adam from a handful of dust taken from different lands, so the children of Adam have been created according to the composition of the land. Therefore from mankind we have white,red, black and yellow ones; we have good and evil, ease and sorrow, and what comes in betweenthem." (Sahih al Bukhari).

Ibn Masud and other companions of the Prophet (PBUH) said that Allah the Almighty sent Gabriel onto the earth to get Him clay from there. The earth said: "I seek refuge in Allah from your decreasing my quantity or disfiguring me." So Gabriel returned and did not take anything. He said: "My Lord, the land sought refuge inYou and it granted."So Allah sent Michael for the same purpose, and the land sought refuge with Allah and it wasgranted. So he went back and said to Allah what Gabriel has said before him. Then Allah sent the Angel of Death, and the land sought refuge in Allah, the angel said: "I also seek refuge with Allah from returning without carrying out His command." So he took clay from the face of the earth and mixed it. He did not take from one particular place, but rather he took white, red, and black clay from different places.The Angel of Death ascended with it, Allah soaked the clay till it became sticky. Then Allah said to the angels:

"Truly, I am going to create man from clay. So when I have fashioned him and breathed into him(his) soul created by Me, then you fall down prostrate to him."
(Chapter 38:71-72 Quran).

So Allah shaped Adam into a human being, but he remained a figure of clay for fourty years. The angels went past him. They were seized with fear by what they saw, and Iblis felt fear most. He used to pass by the figure of Adam, buffeting it, which would make a sound like pottery. Allah told us:

"He created man (Adam) from sounding clay like the clay of pottery."
(Chapter 55:Quran).

When the time drew near to breathe the spirit into Adam, as Allah decreed, He commanded the angels: "When I breathe My spirit into him prostrate before him." Allah breathed His spirit into Adam and when it reached his head Adam sneezed. The angels said: "Say all praise belongs to Allah." Adam repeated: "All praise belongs to Allah." Allah said to him: "Your Lord has granted you mercy." When the spirit reached his eyes, Adam looked at the fruits of Paradise. When it reached his abdomen Adam felt an appetite for food. He jumped hurriedly before the spirit could reach his legs, so that he could eat from the fruits of Paradise. Allah, therefore, said:

"Man is created of haste."
(Chapter 21:37 Quran).

And then:

"The angels prostrated themselves all of them together. Except Iblis, he refused to be among the prostrators."
(Ch 15:31-32 Quran).

Abu Hurairah narrated that the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) said: "Allah created Adam from dustafter He mixed the clay and left him for some time until it became sticky mud, after which Allah shaped him. After that Allah left him till it became like potter's clay. Iblis used to go past him saying 'You have been created for a great purpose.' After that Allah breathed His spirit into him. The first thing into which the spirit passed was his eye and then his nose. He sneezed. Allah said:"May your Lord have mercy upon you, O Adam! Go to those angels and see what they would say.' So Adam went and greeted them. they replied saying: "Peace be upon you and the mercy and blessings of Allah." Allah said: "O Adam! This is your greeting and that of your offspring." (Sahihal Bukhari).

The Meaning of the Angel's Prostration

Adam opened his eyes and saw all the angels prostrating before him except one being who was standing at a distance Adam did not know what kind of creature it was that did not prostrate before him nor did he know its name. Iblis was standing with the angels so as to be included in thecommand given to them but he was not one of them. He was a jinn, and as such he was supposedto be inferior to the angels. What is clear is that this prostration was to show respect and did not mean that the angels were worshipping Adam. Prostrating in worship is done only for Allah. Almighty Allah recounted the story of Iblis's refusal to prostate before Adam:

"Remember when your Lord said to the angels, 'I am going to create a man (Adam) from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud. So when I have fashioned him completely and breathed into him (Adam) the soul which I created for him then fall you down prostrating yourselves unto him'. So the angels prostrated themselves all of them together, except Iblis, herefused to be among the prostrators. Allah said: 'O Iblis! What is your reason for not being among the prostrators?' Iblis said: 'I am not the one to prostrate myself to a human being, whomYou created from sounding clay of altered black smooth mud.' Allah said: 'Then get out fromhere for verily you are Rajim (an outcast or cursed one). Verily the curse shall be upon you till Day of Recompense (Day of Resurrection)'".
(Ch 15:28-35 Quran).

In another surah Almighty Allah recounted it thus:

"Surely We created you (your father Adam) and then gave you shape (the noble shape of ahuman being), then We told the angels: 'Prostrate to Adam and they prostrated except Iblis herefused to be of those who prostrate". Allah said: "What prevented you Iblis that you did not prostrate when I commanded you?" Iblis said: 'I am better than him (Adam), You created me from fire and him You created from clay.' Allah said: 'Get down from this Paradise, it is not for you to be arrogant here. Get out, for youare of those humiliated and disgraced.' Iblis said: 'Allow me respite till the Day of Resurrection).' Allah said: 'You are of those allowed respite.'"
(Ch 7:11-15 Quran).

Ibn Jarir reported that Muhammad Ibn sirin said that the first one to reach a conclusion by reasoning was Iblis and that the sun and moon were not worshiped except through this method. This means that Iblis tried to compare himself to Adam. He believed that he was more honourable than Adam. Therefore he abstained from prostrating even though Allah had commanded him to do so, just as He had commanded the angels. If an analogy is made we see that Iblis is vain. For indeed clay is better than fire because in it can be found the qualities of calmness, clemency, perseverance and growth; whereas in fire can befound heedlessness, insignificance, haste, and incineration.

Iblis tried in vain to justify his refusal:

"Shall I prostrate to one whom You created from clay?" Iblis said: "See? those whom You havehonored above me, if You give me respite (keep me alive) to the Day of Resurrection, I will surely seize and mislead his offspring (by sending them astray) all but a few!"
(Ch 17:62 Quran).

Adam was following what was happening around him and had feelings of love, awe, and astonishment. Deep love of Allah,Who had created and glorified him and Who had made His angels prostrate before him. Awe of the Creator's wrath when He excluded Iblis from His mercy. Adam was surprised by this creature, Iblis who abhorred him without even knowing him and who imagined himself better than Adam without having proved that he was worthier. What a strange creature Iblis was, and how strange was his excuse for not prostrating! He imagined that fire is better than clay, but how did he get such an idea? Such knowledge is exclusive to Allah Who created fire and clay and Who knows which is the better of the two. From the dialogue Adam realized that Iblis was a creature characterized by cunning and ingratitude. He then knew that Iblis was his eternal enemy. He was greatly astonished at Iblis's audacity and Allah's tolerance. Immediately after his creation Adam witnessed the large amount of freedom that Allah gives to His commissioned creatures. Allah knew that Iblis was not going to obey Him in prostrating before Adam. Allah could have totally annihilated him or turned him into a handful of dust or stifled the refusal in his mouth. Yet, Allah gives His commissioned creatures absolute freedom even to the extent that they can refuse Allah the Almighty's commands. He grants them the freedom of denial, disobedience, and even disagreement with Him. His kingdom will not diminish if the disbelievers do not believe in Him nor will it be extended if many people believe in Him. On the contrary, the disbelievers will lose, and the believers will gain but Allah is above all of that.

There were many traditions about Iblis at the time of Prophet Muhammad (PBUH). Ibn Masud, Ibn Abbas and a group of the companions of the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) said that Iblis had been the head of the angels in the worldly heavens. Ibn Abbas said in one narration that his name had been Azazil and in another narration he said it had been Al Harith. Ibn Abbas also said that Iblis was a jinn and that they had once been the keepers of Paradise, with Iblis the most honourable and the most learned and the most pious of them. Another tradition says that he had been one of the famous four possessors of wings (angels), before Allah transformed him into the accursed Satan.

Scimi


Fri Dec 02, 2011 11:00 am
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
thanks. would have preferred a brief ansswer...#

maybe all these strange sightings of lights and aliens, ufos out at sea can thus be explained by the above mentioned


Mon Dec 05, 2011 3:53 pm
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
I would have preferred to give you a brief answer - but that would lead to more questions... So, I decided to just give you the thorough answer, so you may see the whole picture. It took ages to type out lol.

If you have more questions, post them here...

Scimi


Tue Dec 06, 2011 7:45 am
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Unread post The full story
OK, so from what people on here have said and other sources this is the general idea of what occured. Not my own view but based on science, replies to other threads and threads posted on these forums.

There was a big bang and the universe was created. Planets were formed. None could however sustain life.

There was God, Angels, Jinns. They all existed in the heavens exept the jinns who existed on earth.

Then god made man. Satan didnt bow down to man. (now why was he asked to bow and none of the other jinn?) Satan was then exiled down to earth.

God then created eve from Adams rib and they were both left to dwell the garden of eden freely.

They were told not to eat from the forbidden tree.

Satan tempted man and failed. He then tricked eve into tricking/persuading Adam to eat the forbidden fruit.

But does this mean that the garden of eden was on earth as satan had been banished down to earth from the heavens. or did satan crawl up to the garden in the heavens?

Well anyway, Adam and eve were exiled to earth. The dinosaurs were killed off and the jinn were banished to secluded areas to make space for Adam and his seed.

Was Adam and Eve muslims. At that time i take it Islam did not exist, so Adam and eve did not pray namaaz?

The came the prophets and taught man the word of God as a guidance and help/mercy.

Then man spread across the earth.

Satan tempted man as he promised God and lead them astray.

Man then became a foe on to another, as god had foretold.

Then came the dajaal MAking full use of the systems put in place prior to and in preparation for his arival.

Then came Jesus (2nd coming)

Trumpet is blown.

World ends.

EArth is destroyed

Everyone is judged.

some go to hell and some to heaven.

The End?


Last edited by Anonymous on Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.



Tue Dec 13, 2011 4:18 pm
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Unread post Re: The full story
Man didn't create Eve btw, it was Allah who created Eve from the rib of Adam (AS)

The first three chapters of this book *
Watch on scribd.com
* (you can download the PDF there for free) will answer any questions you may have, this thread needs to be merged with your other one also, the topic is the same.

Also, you cannot simplify the history of humanity the way you have done, it just leaves way too many questions which need to be asked and answered. It seems you want history from a religious perspective, the above mentioned book is the most in-depth work on the topic, and a pleasure to read - and contemplate the wisdoms within. I also suggest reading the Quran with tafsir (exegesis) too.

Salaam

Scimi


Wed Dec 14, 2011 4:57 pm
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Unread post Re: The full story
^ very correct :)


Wed Dec 14, 2011 5:01 pm
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Unread post Re: The full story
i can say to you, like it says in the quran. man is born, knows nothing, then grows and knows everything (so to speak), then returns to knowing nothing, then returns to nothingness...(so to speak)

but that leaves so much in between and so many questions, but that is the simple factual truth, as concise as can be.

so i have done the same for the above.


Wed Dec 14, 2011 8:09 pm
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Unread post Re: The full story
rafhelp wrote:

The End?


SO, WHAT ELSE DO YOU WANT???????? :?

AGREED WITH SCIMI. things are not confines to 20-25 lines. read history or tafseer you would like turns and twist and the dignity of human power for which Allah created man above His other creations.

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Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:21 am
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Unread post Re: Man sinned and...
* Similar topics merged.

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From Imam Ali (pbuhaf):

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YOU MUST READ THIS - The WILL of our Holy Messenger!
The 5 Definite Signs
How to create a fake Imam Mahdi


Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:58 am
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